Podcast: Modern Hire’s Eric Sydell on Science and Talent Acquisition

Modern Hire

Mark:

Welcome to People Tech, the podcast of The HCM Technology Report. I’m Mark Feffer.

Mark:

My guest today is Eric Sydell, the executive vice president of innovation at Modern Hire. Their solutions provide screening, assessment, interview and workflow automation tools to streamline hiring. And, they do a lot of research on talent and talent intelligence. We’ll talk about selection science in a changing labor market on this edition of People Tech.

Mark:

Eric, welcome. Now, Modern Hire is an interesting company. You take a different approach, I think, in a lot of your marketing and outreach efforts. You talk a lot about your methodology, you talk a lot about the technology and the software that’s behind what you do. Could you explain that all to us and put it in perspective?

Eric:

Sure. Yeah. Modern Hire came about by several different companies that were merged together, and we started about two decades ago. It was originally started, the group was, by psychologists, IO psychologists, of which I am one. Our idea was to really use science, hardcore, rigorous science to try to determine who should be hired, who would be most successful in the jobs that our clients were posting.

Eric:

That DNA feeds through until today and it underlies everything that we create, and do and put out there in the market. We have almost 50, I think, PhD psychologists and data scientists on team, so the company is heavily driven by that type of thinking that they bring forth. It’s very based on science. It’s very based on collecting data, seeing what works, refining it, improving it, putting it out there.

Eric:

That seems obvious, probably that’s what any company would, but I do think that we’re driven very significantly by science when a lot of companies out there may focus a little bit more on marketing, or hype or clear and easy statements of why their tools work, that don’t really provide a lot of in-depth insight into how they work, on how well they work, or under what circumstances they work and things like that. We’ve always been very, very focused on science.

Eric:

Science is cold, and hard and logical and not emotional. I think a lot of times, in marketing, you have to connect with people on an emotional level. That’s always a gap that has to be bridged in what we do. We have to make sure that we’re adequately communicating the ins and outs of our process, and why it’s good, why it’s beneficial for our clients.

Mark:

There’s obviously a lot going on in the market today, in the labor market. Employers are looking for all the tools they can get, and the more advanced tools, the better. How is all of that impacting Modern Hire? And, what are you seeing among your customers? And how what’s been called the Great Resignation is impacting them?

Eric:

Yeah, absolutely. Clearly, there has been a great difficulty for companies in all aspects of the economy of finding people right now, through the pandemic. It seems as though the pandemic has not just led to businesses like restaurants having difficulty and things like that, but more of an awakening amongst the workforce, to not just a resignation but an awakening of what people will do, what they want to do, what they want to put up with, the type of lifestyle that they want to have and things like that. I think that it’s going to take a number of years to really parse through all of these trends that are happening right now and develop a deep understanding of it.

Eric:

For right now, the here and now, our clients need to be able to hire people to run their businesses. It’s very important, more than ever, to have a hiring process that’s easy to get through, that’s fast, that helps you make decisions about candidates quickly. And certainly, a process that doesn’t get in the way of candidates applying. I think that, unfortunately, there’s a lot of bureaucratic layers to, especially large companies hiring processes, they can take some time for candidates to get through and that can be a turnoff.

Eric:

Our perspective is you collect high quality data and information on candidates. We use science, statistics, AI, all sorts of things, to help understand what that data means so that you can make a valid, high quality decision on who to hire. And, a fair decision as well. That doesn’t change, no matter what is going on in the economy. You still need to be able to make good decisions about people. And ultimately, we want to collect the smallest amount of information we can on candidates to enable the best decision about who to hire, fairly and accurately. People that are going to perform and people that are going to meet diversity needs as well.

Eric:

Like I said, that doesn’t change. I think companies, a lot of times, right now in particular, are overly reactive to the market. They’re worried that they won’t be able to staff their positions so they’re sometimes cutting steps out of the hiring processes in an effort to make it as fast as possible. That’s a very short term type of thinking, I believe. Because if you have the right process in place, where you’re collecting high quality data, it shouldn’t be that long of a process anyway. You should be able to get to a decision on who you’re going to hire very quickly with data, and that doesn’t change.

Eric:

We encourage clients, companies to put in place tools to collect good, quality information that you can use to make very rapid decisions. That was the same before the pandemic and continues to be the case.

Mark:

Now, to step back a little bit and ask you to put your industry expert hat on. What’s being called the Great Resignation, record amounts of people quitting their jobs for better opportunities, sometimes they’re quitting before they even have the other opportunity. Is this a blip or is this a new way of talent acquisition?

Eric:

That is a great question. I don’t have the old crystal ball with me today, but I suspect that it’s not a blip but that there will be some sort of return to relative normalcy at some point. I think that awakenings don’t just dissipate, and disappear and go back to total normal. This is an evolution so there is an awakening that will continue, I think, in the workforce to say that people want jobs that are appealing to them, that support their lifestyle, that meet their needs. And, they maybe don’t want to slave away for low dollar amounts as much as they used to tolerate. That’s been awakened in them, that realization, and I don’t think that goes away ever.

Eric:

But, I do think as well that it’s quite possible that the pendulum will swing back a little bit and it will become easier for companies to hire people, as we keep moving through this evolution, this cycle related to the pandemic. Ultimately, I think that’s a little bit of both, I guess. It’s definitely some element of awakening that won’t go away, I don’t think.

Eric:

We, at Modern Hire, for 20 years we’ve been building realistic job previews as one of the tools that we help our clients with. The idea with those have always been to bring the candidate into the job, to help them understand the nature of the job and the organization. I do not need to sell them on it. Those are not sales pieces, the realistic job preview is realistic. It’s meant to convey the essence, the true nature of a role and a company. That is indicative of our perspective, that hiring needs to be a two-way information exchange where you’re helping candidates understand the role, the company and what they’re getting into. You want them to know what the job is all about so that they can be part of the decision, deciding whether it’s right for them or not.

Eric:

That’s been our perspective for two decades and I think that is only becoming more important now for companies. Because they’re recognizing that they have to actually attract people, and be candid and be human with their candidate pools. Not put out a slick ad that paints this organization as the greatest thing since sliced bread, and then subject them to a lengthy, bureaucratic, frustrating hiring experience. And then, they come on board and realize that the role really has little in common with the information they were given up front. Not effective. Not effective, but that happens all the time.

Eric:

I liken it to if you were on a date. If you’re going on a date with a potential romantic partner, and if you are just going to maybe try to sell them on why you’re amazing and not have any dialogue with them, and see what they’re like, and what they want and what they’re interested in. That has to be a two-way information exchange on a date. It’s funny that, a lot of times, in corporate jobs and the corporate world, it’s much more one-sided. It doesn’t make sense, it shouldn’t be that way.

Eric:

I think some of those trends that we’ve been trying to push for a long time are more important than ever now. It does seem as well, like the tide is turning a little bit, the balance of power is being upset a little bit by all of this in that companies used to hold all the cards, and now the workforce is starting to hold more cards. It’s starting to become a little bit more balanced in favor of the individual worker.

Mark:

Last question is that changing dynamic, how does that impact Modern Hire?

Eric:

Well, you noted in the beginning that we seem a little bit different than the normal company out there maybe. I think that we’ve always tried to stay the course. We have come at this, from the beginning, with a belief in the scientific process not in trying to sell and market magical products that just work. But, collecting data, refining, continually building.

Eric:

We’ve also come at it from the beginning with a great appreciation for the candidate experience and for what candidates, what individuals need out of the hiring process. Like I said, we were started by psychologists so we think that way. We didn’t go into psychology so that we could take the humanity out of the hiring process. We went into psychology because we’re interested in people, and what makes them tick, and how they can work better and things like that.

Eric:

It’s the scientific process, the candidate experience, those are more important than ever now. The reality is we’ve been doing that for two decades. In a lot of ways, it doesn’t change what we do. That’s always been our belief and we’ve always stuck to our guns in that regard, and that just continues now. We don’t have to turn on a dime and say, “Well, we’re not selling this product or that product anymore because the tide has changed.” Well, we’re selling and talking about fundamental hiring process steps and things you can do to build a process that works, regardless of the economic conditions and it’s good for candidates, regardless of what’s going on in the external world.

Mark:

Eric, thanks very much for joining us today.

Eric:

You’re welcome. It was great to chat with you.

Mark:

My guest today has been Eric Sydell, the executive vice president of innovation at Modern Hire. And this has been People Tech, the podcast of The HCM Technology Report. We’re a publication of RecruitingDaily. We’re also a part of Evergreen Podcasts. To see all of their programs, visit www.evergreenpodcasts.com. And to keep up with HR technology, visit The HCM Technology Report every day. We’re the most trust source of news in the HR tech industry. Find us at www.hcmtechnologyreport.com. I’m Mark Feffer.

Image: Modern Hire

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